Purchase Bitter Ice From The Author
Transcript of Online Chat With Barbara Kent Lawrence
*** Log file opened: 3/9/00 7:53:32 PM
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[19:53] <#SupportGroup> For open chat please visit #OpenSupport
[19:53] <#SupportGroup> Schedule for SupportGroup & MoreSupport: www.transformations.com
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[19:54] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> HI everyone
[19:54] <DragonTF> {{{{{{{{{{Barbara}}}}}}}}} Hi! :)
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[19:54] <JourneyTF> Hi {{{{{{{Barbara}}}}}}}}}
[19:54] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> {{{{{{{{{Dragon et al}}}}}}}}}}
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[19:55] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> TY Dragon and BTW I'm ROFL :)
[19:55] <DragonTF> ROFL!!!!!!!
[19:55] <JourneyTF> LOL!!
[19:55] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence>
[19:56] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> IMO, this is a gas.
[19:56] <DragonTF> LOL!!
[19:56] <DragonTF> ROFL!!
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[19:56] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Just tell me when I;m supposed to get semi-serious.
[19:56] <DragonTF> Will do
[19:57] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Too bad about the web site - must have been an irritating day for you.
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[19:57] <DragonTF> The website is in a wee funk.We're very happy TalkCity is feeling fine tonight though...
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[19:58] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Indeed.
[19:59] DragonTF changes topic to "Join us at now for Bitter Ice author Barbara Kent Lawrence!!"
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[20:02] <DragonTF> Welcome everyone! It's great to see you here!
[20:02] <DragonTF> Tonight we continue Transformations fifth anniversary celebration with our special guest Dr. Barbara Kent Lawrence, author of Bitter Ice - A memoir of love, food and obsession.
[20:03] <DragonTF> In a style laced with eloquence and grace, Lawrence spins a compelling tale...a tale as poetic as it is horrific...a wonderful and insightful story that is so shocking readers will wish it was born ofimagination and not reality.
[20:03] <DragonTF> Bitter Ice is, in fact, a true account of Lawrence's life - her upbringing in a privileged family in which she is exposed to wealth and luxury, much of which she is never truly a part.
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[20:04] <DragonTF> The first child of a former British actress, Lawrence spends much of her youth searching for and drawing near to, yet never quite finding the love she craves from her absent, alcoholic father, the stepfather she adores or her distant and at times cruel mother.
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[20:04] <DragonTF> As her life unfolds, the patterns so ingrained during Lawrence's childhood begin to emerge and are reflected in her relationships, specifically her marriage.
[20:04] <DragonTF> Lawrence paints a vivid and detailed picture of her marriage to a man who, haunted by his own demons, traps himself and his family in the toxicity of his illnesses - alcoholism and anorexia.
[20:04] <DragonTF> So extreme are his rituals and his need to control the world around him, they overshadow everything in the family system. Lawrence finds herself socially isolated, controlled and desperate in her need to escape.
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[20:05] <DragonTF> Her memoir is a tribute to the fact that she did escape...that she survived and is not only surviving, but blossoming and thriving.
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[20:05] <DragonTF> Tonight I'm pleased and honored to introduce to you Dr. Barbara Kent Lawrence.
[20:05] <DragonTF> Welcome Barbara, thank you for joining us tonight.
[20:05] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Thank you, I think you have done a better job than I did of summing up my life.
[20:06] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> TY all for being here tonight. I appreciate the chance to chat with you.
[20:06] <DragonTF> Barbara, like so many people, your childhood formed the basis of your life later on. In Bitter Ice, you describe a lonely and frequently painful youth. Can you outline those formative years for us?
[20:07] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> The most iportant thing was that my father was away in the war, and then when he returned my parents divorced soon after.
[20:07] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> They had known each other a very short time - two weeks before they got engaged, another month before they married. It was war time - but their chances of a successful marriage anf reindship were minimal.
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[20:08] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I felt really awful as a child of divorced parents, because so few parents then were divoorced. .ga
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[20:08] <DragonTF> Sometime after the divorce, your mother remarried. What was that new family structure like for you? ga
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[20:09] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Also - as a child, I rarely saw my father, particularly after my mother remarried and we moved to another city. I have sometimes thought of myself then as Cinderella without the prince!
[20:10] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I think I grew up thinking I was sort of a second class citizen in the family, particularly after my mother had two more children. ga
[20:10] <DragonTF> Love and the role of love played a big part in your early life. Can you describe that for us?
[20:10] <DragonTF> ga
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[20:12] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I loved my new stepfather although he was distant from me and his own children. I loved my sister and brother but I never really felt loved or a wholly a part of the family. The "person" I loved most was my dog!
[20:12] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> But it wasn't until I was writing the book that I realized my mother;s and father;s ability to love was formed by their parents inability to love them.
[20:12] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> And that was not their fault, just as their inability to really love me was not mine. ga
[20:13] <DragonTF> You grew up in the 1950's and came of age in the 1960's, a time period in which women's roles were still defined in terms of being a "good mother" or a "good wife". How do you feel that sort of cultural expectation affected you?
[20:13] <DragonTF> ga
[20:14] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> That's a big one too, Daragon. I lived two lives in some ways - I had an intelletual, academic life, and I wanted a career. A man once asked me to marry him and told me I would of course drop out of college because he would teach me what I needed to know. That didn't last long.
[20:14] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> But I also wanted to be a mother and a wife, though not in the terms in which my mother and her freinds had defined those roles. ga
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[20:15] <DragonTF> You realize over the course of time your marriage is similar to your upbringing in many ways. How so?
[20:15] <DragonTF> ga
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[20:16] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I think it is hard for some women my age to try to be both our mother;s (and do the volunteer work, housekeeping, etc, etc,) and our daughters and have a full career. We want both and its very tough.
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[20:16] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I didn't really come to terms with that until I was writing the book. i know that sounds odd - but the act of writing and then reading what I had written forced me to look at myself and my life in ways I had avoided before.ga
[20:17] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> The ways in which it was similar - I was married to a man who was a shadow, like my father.
[20:18] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Sorry - Dragon, I forgot the ga. There are other similarites we can discuss too.
[20:18] <DragonTF> LOL
[20:18] <DragonTF> Much of Bitter Ice focuses on your husband Tom's illness and patterns of destruction....
[20:19] <DragonTF> He exhibited signs of illness early on, although he was able to mask his behavior with various forms of denial. Can you relate some of these behaviors?
[20:19] <DragonTF> ga
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[20:19] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I think I was used to a level of affection and connection with a man that was so minimal that Tom seemed familiar to me. Some of the behaviors developed over a long time - 27 years! But started with excessive running, running carrying heavy rocks up mountains, running until his feet bled.
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[20:20] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> He wore layers of sweat clothes because he said he had a circulatory problem, inherited from his mother who had died, and had to purge himself of water.
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[20:22] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Then he rarely ate anything fattening, started drinking more, and eventually the symptoms included eating ice constantly, (to avoif food), eating bizarre concoctions that would have been obnoxious to anyone else, wearing odd looking clothes. Remember this all happened over 27 yeras so it is hard to remember the exact sequence. Also he would have "good" and" bad" times when sysmptoms changed.
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[20:22] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Another part of eating disorders is the personality changes. The brain can't funciton the same way it does in a well-nourished body - the person gets cranky, controlling, and has, forgive me , what our kids used to call, "Dad's brain farts."
[20:23] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> He also started stealing - small stuff from the market, change form me and our office, and lying about little stuff - but like a kid, not fessing up to things. ga.
[20:24] <DragonTF> If you have a question or comment for Barbara, please 1/1 JourneyTF and she will put you in the queue.
[20:24] <DragonTF> Aside from being an alcoholic, your husband, Tom was also anorexic, which may surprise many people since anorexia is widely regarded as a women's disease. In fact, a number of therapists misdiagnosed him, correct?
[20:24] <DragonTF> ga
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[20:25] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> That;s right and one reason I want to talk with people abut this illness in men. Tom was hospitalized once and afterwards started seeing a psychiatrist. One time he asked the man if he was anorexic, and the doctor replied, NO. only women are anorexic. in fact aover a million men have eating disorders and the number of men with ED had doubled in the last ten years. ga
[20:25] <DragonTF> Those are astounding figures!
[20:26] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> There are others that worry me even more. For example, doctors are treating boys as young as 5 - 6, and 40% of college students with bulimia are men. ga
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[20:27] <DragonTF> It sounds like it's time to wake up about this issue...
[20:27] <DragonTF> Tom was able to diagnose himself, but was in essence shot down?
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[20:27] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Definitely., I have joined a couple of the men;s eating disorders clubs and it is very painful to me to hear them and the women who care about them starting the same road I was on so many years ago. I know we need to put a light on this path!
[20:28] <DragonTF> Yes
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[20:28] <DragonTF> Twenty-seven years is a long time..
[20:28] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Doctors I have talked with tell me that they think the number of men is way underreported because it is so hard for them to admit to having a woman;s disease and also hard to get help.
[20:29] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Dr. Ira Sacker told me recently that he treas an equal number of boys and girls before puberty but that after adolescence the number of boys in treatment plummets. And it isn't because they have gotten well.
[20:29] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I think we have to realize that boys and men are now subject to many of the same pressures women are and are just as vulnerable - though they may take that vulnerability out in other ways. ga
[20:30] <DragonTF> Yes, exactly.
[20:30] <DragonTF> I've got one more question and then we have some questions from the audience...
[20:30] <DragonTF> You stayed in the marriage for 27 years. Many survivors of domestic abuse and spousal abuse describe remaining in the relationship for lengthy periods of time. What do you feel kept you there and what propelled you to leave?
[20:30] <DragonTF> ga
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[20:31] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I was scared to leave becaue I didn't want to fail. Also - as I said eearlier that kind of relatinship seemed familiar. Once I had kids I really didn't want to leave because I didn't want them to have a stepfather. then I think I got hooked on being the strong successful one - that;s the danger of being an enabler.
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[20:32] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I didn't see how much of an enabler I was until I was writing Bitter Ice. But now I see that I needed his weakness to make me feel strong - I was getting something out of the relationship - but it wasn't healthy. ga
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[20:33] <DragonTF> We're going to take some audience questions, Journey?
[20:33] <JourneyTF> First, sea-eyes would like to ask a question...
[20:33] JourneyTF sets mode: +v sea-eyes
[20:34]where did you meet your husband?
[20:34] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I met him in dancing school as a kid but he was going out with someone else. I wasn't attracted to him, but then I re-met him as adult in NYC. We were freinds because we grew up in the same place.
[20:35] <DragonTF> If you have a question or comment for Barbara, please 1/1 JourneyTF and she will put you in the queue.
[20:35] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> But it wasn't unti; another friend a woman, asked me why I was involved with him that I got interested. I think I was feeling old and single. my stepfather had just died and my boyfreind had married someone else. ga
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[20:36] <JourneyTF> Next, yamocat...
[20:37] <yamocat> Do the doctors know what may cause eating disorders? Perhaps geeenetics or environmental upbringing or combination of both?
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[20:38] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Great question. I think you are right it is both. Ira Sacker told me all the boys he treats who are very young are part of a lineage of eating disorders - in other words they have members of their families with ED. IRa can trace it back 4 generations in some families. But its the old question - nurture or nature?
[20:39] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> There are differences between boys and girls in this too - but not enough study of males. It sems boys who grow up in a chaotic family - where there is alcoholism are vulnerable.
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[20:40] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Also boys whose families are perfectionists, controlling, and with girls it tends to involve abuse as well. I think the question you ask is the one researchers are struggling to answer. ga
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[20:41] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> One more thing - I;m worried that a lack of nurturing adds to the pressure on boys - and with so many of us mother wokring - it is hard for us to be totally nurturing too.
[20:42] <JourneyTF> We will hear a question from Amiee34 next...
[20:42] JourneyTF sets mode: +v Amiee34
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[20:43] <JourneyTF> Amiee is having a little technical difficulty...here is her question...
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[20:45] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> While we are waiting - I wonder if anyone has rad Real Boys.
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[20:46] <DragonTF> I haven't.. is it good?
[20:46] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> It made me so sad, made me realize how much I missed my son that I called him up and told him, and siad I wanted to come visit him. he seemed really pleased when I said, "ive spent too much of my life missing you and now I want to do something about it."
[20:47] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> So I went to NYC where he lives and we had a great 24 hours. Real Boys give us permission to see our sons as kids not little men.
[20:47] <DragonTF> Wow!!
[20:47] <DragonTF> That's great!
[20:47] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> However, I;ve only read the first 51 pages - but it did have a big impact on me!
[20:48] <DragonTF> WIll have to check that book out!
[20:48] <DragonTF> Barbara, did you see Aimee's question?
[20:49] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> NO - I didn't.
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[20:49] <DragonTF> Let me try it one more time
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[20:49] <DragonTF> She asks: Do you have any advice for women in controlling or abusive relationships?
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[20:50] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> yes. the first thing is to think about why you are in the relationship, I think. Ask what it is giving you. There;s going to be something that matches something you find failiar.
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[20:50] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> A therapist once told me that couples are like bats. They can't see eeach other but the find who they need. i think there is a lot of wisdom in that. its; not what I wanted to hear but I think it is true.
[20:50] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Second - reach out for help.
[20:51] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Third - I finally was able to - I dedicated my book to my freinds and family who welcome me back. i had turned away from them, not they from me.
[20:51] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I also believe very strongly in God, though i didn't use to. I began to realize that God loves me, as he loves each one of us and that made me feel really loved.
[20:52] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> But I think there are many kinds of abuse, and if you had asked me if I was in an abusive relationship, I wouldn't have seen it.
[20:53] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Also - When I got close to being 50 I started thinking about the fact that my parents had died at 53 and 55 (within two months of each other) and that I had to do something about my life or I would be dead too. i tookinventory of what I liked and then I tried to think how I could get back to those things.
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[20:53] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I meant , what I liked about myself that I had lost over the years and I tried to think of ways to get those qualities and abilities back. I went back to school part-time in preparation for leaving .ga
[20:54] <DragonTF> We have quite a few questions. I apologize for the delay. It seems TalkCity is acting up. Journey, who do we have next?
[20:54] <JourneyTF> Next is CosmoAA ..
[20:54] DragonTF sets mode: +v CosmoAA
[20:54] <CosmoAA> I hope you don't mind me asking this, but what ultimately became of Tom? Did he ever get any real help? Thank you for coming tonight!
[20:54] DragonTF sets mode: -v CosmoAA
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[20:55] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> YW Thak you for asking. The great news, which I;ve learned recently, is that he is doing very well. It is a day to day thing. but he just agreed to go on a major tv show with me!
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[20:55] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> This may not happen - but the fact that he agrees to be interviewed is tremendous. He can now say he was /is ill and will always have to fight these demons, but he is doing it with support.
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[20:57] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I wrote Bitter ICe because I needed to - but I published it in part because I hped bringing all this out in the open would help Tom and our family and it makes me really happy to see that happenig.
[20:57] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> sorry = I forgot the .ga
[20:57] <DragonTF> LOL
[20:57] <JourneyTF> We are ready for our next question....DeDe?
[20:57] DragonTF sets mode: +v DeDe331
[20:58] <DeDe331> What effects did his behavior have on your children? Thank you for being here tonight.
[20:58] DragonTF sets mode: -v DeDe331
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[20:59] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Thank you and everyone else. it helps me to talk about this stuff. My kids seem well. I worry more about my son because he has a tougher time I think. My daughter is in law school - she got a full scholarship thank heaven - and she just got engaged to a wonderful, well-grounded guy who loves her lots.
[21:00] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> My son is very talented - a much better writer than I am, and I hope he writes a book of his own some day. ga
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[21:00] <DragonTF> I have to mention Barbara is an excellent writer
[21:00] <DragonTF> ga
[21:00] <JourneyTF> We have a question from ShadowDancer88 ...
[21:00] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> My kids were also always very protective of their father. They love him and know he is ill, in fact I think they saw it before I was able to admit it. ga
[21:00] DragonTF sets mode: +v ShadowDancer88
[21:00] <ShadowDancer88> Having lived with anorexia most of my life, from 14 on, I often wonder is there much chance of ever looking in a mirror and seeing a true image rather than the one
[21:00] <ShadowDancer88> I see daily? and What made you decide to write about your experiences and have you found it to be theraputic? Also at
[21:00]the time of writing did you find yourself re-living old traumas? thx for being here!!!g/a
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[21:01] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Yes, geat quesitons. I wrote the book becasue I went to a class to help me write my dissertation. The first assignemnt? To respond to an essay. The title? On Food and Happiness.
[21:02] <DragonTF> Wow
[21:02] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I thought - I can't do that - and I couldn't but I realized I could write about food and unhappinedd - so I did. I had never told anyone before about how we were living and I thought I was hidiing it all. I wasn't- but I thought I was.
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[21:03] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> So - yes, writing was incredibly therapeutic for me. I hope you all try it. Don't write for anyone else just for you. And let it all hang out on the line where you have to really look at the laundry you had hidden in the closet.
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[21:03] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Shadow - I think anorexia has a lot to do with how you see your self worth. What can you do to help you see yourself as valued and valuable?
[21:04] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> You may have to be your own nurturer - you have to care enough about yourself to see your real self. Your mirrored self is what you have been told by people around you that you are. But your true self is what you can be and want to be.
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[21:05] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I was writing one time about my mother coming to see my son in the hospital after he was born. She sat on the edge of the chair and stayed 5 minutes. I realized in writing about it that she rejected him (because of her insecurities) not becasue he was a bad kid. he was after all ine day old! So then I thought maybe that was true about me as well and I realized it was her insecurities that had made me feel rejected not something inately bad about me. ga
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[21:08] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Hey - anybody there?
[21:08] <JourneyTF> Our next question comes from Stascia...
[21:09] DragonTF sets mode: +v Stascia
[21:09] <JourneyTF> LOL, yes
[21:09] <Stascia> How does a person determine if she has a eating disorder? i have been big since i was a little girl and can't seem to lose any weight, unless i was on drugs..i believe that's why i decided to relapse a while ago to lose weight. would that be considered a eating disorder? Thanks for sharing with us.....
[21:09] DragonTF sets mode: -v Stascia
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[21:10] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Hey thanks to you. You're sharing too! I think there are los of weight tables and stuff like that - but you should check with a doctor, particularly if you are worried about it. but anorexia or bulimia involve extreme mesures to lose weight and preoccupation with weight.
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[21:11] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Also anorexia and bulimia aren't jsut about losing weight - they often include extreme exercising. one of my fomrer husband;s symptoms was eating ice constantly so he would't eat food. Also rituals and secercy about food, bulimia involves over-eating and then vomiting. So - if you are worried check with someone. ga
[21:12] DragonTF sets mode: +v SunnyPeach57
[21:12] <JourneyTF> SunnyPeach57 is next...
[21:13] <DragonTF> Sunny you there?
[21:14] <DragonTF> She's typing
[21:14] <SunnyPeach57> I work with abuse survivors, but am one myself, how can I deal with flash backs and wanting to self abuse again??
[21:15] DragonTF sets mode: -v SunnyPeach57
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[21:15] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Wow, that;s a toughone. Remember, I was jsut an enabler, so there;s a lot you have gone through that I haven't. The only thing I can think of is that when I was writing I would literally lie down on the floor and sink my way mentally into a deep dark slimy well.
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[21:16] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> When I was finished a seciton, sometimes I was crying and sobbing so hard I couldn't breath, but when I was really finished, I would work my way up the sides of the well
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[21:17] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> and then climb out into the fresh air. Mind you I was just lying on the floor in my apartment! but the mind is a powerful tool. If you give yoursefl a safe way out I think it is a lot easier to go back into the mess you have to deal with and walk away from.
[21:18] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> And the magic for me was that in writing I found I could see things I hadn't and I could forgive both myself for not protecting me better as a child, and my parents, because they were after all only human and doing the best they could given their lives. ga
[21:18] <JourneyTF> yamocat also has a question...yamocat?
[21:18] DragonTF sets mode: +v yamocat
[21:18] <yamocat> Can eating disorders be cured? If so what is cure? Or how are they treated medically? Psychologically? or anything else? Thank you for answering and being here for us. God bless. Oh , also how is an eating disorder diagnosed?
[21:19] DragonTF sets mode: -v yamocat
[21:19] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I think eating orders can be cured, but it is important to get help early and for a whole family. Sometimes medical intervention is necessary becasue the person is close to death.
[21:20] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Girls with anorexia at 12 times more liekly to die than peers who don't have it.
[21:20] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> there are real consequences medically - like losing teeth, getting osteoporesis etc. so that has to be dealth with medically. I think there are also medicine - but I am on shapy ground here as I am not a medical doctor.
[21:21] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> The diagnosis has to do with the relatedbehaviors and a substantial weight loss - i think it is 15% of "normal" body weight.
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[21:22] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Sorry - I meant shaky ground. I think most of the wrok is psychological help to help the person seem her or himself as she/he really is - and to accept a normal weight. Anorexia in my husband;s case seemed a slow way to commit suicide and perhaps it is in others as well - so you have to help someone see why they want to live.
[21:22] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> . and .ga
[21:22] <JourneyTF> LUST4LIFEX is next with a question....
[21:22] DragonTF sets mode: +v LUST4LIFEX
[21:22] <LUST4LIFEX> What do you think of the dynamics of a man being abused by a woman, in comparison to a woman being abused by a man? Have you touched on this in your research or anywhere in your book?
[21:23] DragonTF sets mode: -v LUST4LIFEX
[21:23] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> i thik that is really interesting and you culd say I was abusing my husband because I was realtively so successful. towards the end of our marriage I thought I was going nuts too because I was dreaming he was dead, fantasizing about wasy to get rid of him
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[21:24] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I left him because I thought it was the best thing for both of us and our kids and that we all deserved a second chacne. i was abusing him by enabling him, disabling him by enabling if you will and that wasn't fair of me to do.
[21:24] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Sorry my typing it getting so inaccurate.
[21:25] <DragonTF> We'll take one more question and then we have a comment..
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[21:25] <JourneyTF> books2 is our last question..
[21:25] DragonTF sets mode: +v books2
[21:25] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I think we learn these behaviors as children and we re-create our childhood in our relationships unless we look very carefully at where we came from. ga
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[21:26] <JourneyTF> This is from books...
[21:27] DragonTF sets mode: -v books2
[21:27] <JourneyTF> when you are at the bottum of the well, how do you remeber a safe way out, i
[21:27] <JourneyTF> always forget-prefer to hurt my self
[21:27] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> You practice and you have to want to get out. A friend who is a writer taught me that trick and it worked. but maybe you want to set other guidelines to make it feel safe for you. Like have a friend ther.
[21:28] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Or just decide beforehand that you are only going to think about a small thing that worries you.
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[21:29] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Or have something waiting for you on the surface that is a treat., I believe in treating myself! I learned that recently thoug. in a way I learned to have Big barbara take care of Little Barbara when she needed to be cared for. Like I started getting a good haircut and giving myself flowers. it worked!
[21:29] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I want to add that i have really enjoyed this. Thank you all and if you ever have time to read the book, let me know . I;d love to chat again. Barbara
[21:30] <DragonTF> thank you so much Barbara! You can pick up Barbara's book Bitter Ice at bookstores and online at amazon.com
[21:30] DragonTF sets mode: -m
[21:30] <JourneyTF> {{{{{{{Barbara}}}}}}}}} thanks!! We do have one more comment from ShadowDancer88 ....
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[21:30] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> {{{{{{{{{to all of you}}}}}}}}
[21:30] <JourneyTF> ShadowDancer.. I daily try to see within the mirror the real me, yet it is buried deep beneath the wants and needs of others, long ago imposed on a child,
[21:31] <JourneyTF> thus forcing the real me deep into hiding....
[21:31] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Yes. I know that feeling. But you can reach out and hug that child.
[21:32] <DragonTF> {{{{{{{{{{Barbara}}}}}}}}}}}}} Thank you again!!
[21:32] AHorkay thanks Barbara very much for coming
[21:32] <DragonTF> And thank you everyone!
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[21:32] <JourneyTF> {{{{{{{{{Barbara}}}}}}}}}}}} This was a great chat!! Thank you for being here!!
[21:32] <LUST4LIFEX> thx barbara
[21:32] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> You are so welcome.
[21:32] <HopefulTF> {{{{{{{{{Barbara}}}}}}}} Thank you for sharing with us!!
[21:33] DragonTF applauds!!
[21:33] Cidhartha applauds!!!!
[21:33] <books2> ty
[21:33] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> thank all of you. take care of yourselves and go buy a flower!
[21:33] <FeelTheFire37> what type of support here?
[21:33] <smartichat> thanks so much Barbara, this was awsome
[21:33] <Haley-guest> ty Barbara
[21:33] DeDe331 applauds!! ThankYou!
[21:33] <ShadowDancer88> thanks..............
[21:33] <DragonTF> Thanks all! :)
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[21:33] <SilverMirror> Thank you very much.
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[21:33] <SilverMirror> Good night...
[21:34] AHorkay gives Barbara a standing ovation and thanks our nice hosts too
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[21:34] AngelTF sets mode: +o AngelTF
[21:34] <LUST4LIFEX> Good luck with your book. ciao
[21:34] <bijou2^> thank you
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[21:34] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> I am really touched. Thank you.
[21:34] <AngelTF> Barbara, thank you for coming tonight!
[21:34] <^Sparkle> I will be looking for the book tomorrow.
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[21:34] <DragonTF> It's excellent Sparkle!
[21:34] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> hey the next one is a love story about all the things I wished had happened! Another kind of therapy.... I think we are supposed to sign of.....
[21:34] <Lil65> {{{{{{{Barbara}}}}}}}}} Thank you for being here for us and sharing with us. Blessings on you.
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[21:34] <AngelTF> {{{Dragon}}} {{{Journey}}} {{{Hopeful}}}
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[21:35] <HopefulTF> {{{{{{{{{Angel}}}}}}}}}}
[21:35] <DragonTF> Be looking for Barbara's next book!! :)
[21:35] <DeDe331> ((((((((( TF's )))))))))
[21:35] <^Sparkle> When does the next book come out?
[21:35] <JourneyTF> {{{{{Angel}}}}}}}}}
[21:35] <Haley-guest> yeah thank you
[21:35] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Great - and thanks again. Well - first I have to finish it!
[21:35] <magoo_8> thank you barbara
[21:35] <Haley-guest> I am gonna read it too and i am only 12! hehehehe
[21:35] <ShadowDancer88> (((((((((((((Angel, Journey, Dragon Hopeful and Barbara))))))))))))))))))))
[21:35] <DragonTF> Check out our website at www.transformations.com for our Anniversary calendar!
[21:36] <DragonTF> ROFL HAley
[21:36] <Barbara_Kent_Lawrence> Great - Haley. OK - Bob has made dinner and I have to go enjoy. Everyone else -take care of yourselves and have fun. Those are my new mottoes!
[21:36] JourneyTF: {{{{{{{{Everyone}}}}}}}}}}}}} This was a great chat! :)
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[21:36] <yamocat> I'll make a NOTE OFIT jOURNEY T/Y
[21:36] DragonTF invites you all to cruise on back for our Abuse Survivors chat at 11pm ET
[21:36] <HopefulTF> Never too early to learn Haley :-)
[21:36] <yamocat> oops caps
[21:37] <DragonTF> Take care Barbara!! Thanks! :)
[21:37] *** Disconnected ***
*** Log file closed: 3/9/00 9:37:10 PM
Email: barbaralawrence@attbi.com